I don’t know if all hospitals follow law on single-sex spaces, says minister

Scotland’s equalities minister has said she does not know “for a fact” that all hospitals and health boards in Scotland are following the law on single-sex spaces.

Kaukab Stewart told Holyrood’s equalities committee that she “can’t sit here and say every single hospital or local board” is complying with equalities regulations.

Conservative MSP Pam Gosal claimed that public bodies such as Police Scotland and the NHS were not following the law on the matter.

She cited the 1992 Workplace (Health, Safety and Welfare) Regulations, which require separate changing rooms for men and women.

Her question comes amid the ongoing tribunal brought forward against NHS Fife by Sandie Peggie, a nurse who was suspended after objecting to sharing a changing room with a trans doctor.

Ms Gosal said it was the Scottish Government’s duty to ensure public bodies comply with equalities regulations.

“However,” she said, “we have seen female nurses and female police officers being forced to share changing facilities with biologically male colleagues.

“So why are the NHS health boards and Police Scotland not complying with these regulations?”

The equalities minister said: “Well, I don’t know for a fact that they’re not, right?

“I mean, I can’t sit here and say that every single hospital or local board … I don’t think that it would be reasonable to expect me to have that right here and now.

“What I would say to you is that I would refer back to my earlier comments, is that if we start with dignity and fairness, and if we make sure that we take the measures that are proportionate, and if we do that, nobody should be forced, and that includes anyone from any community at all, to be put in an undignified position.

“I’m very clear on that, I always have been, wherever that is on the public estate”.

Ms Gosal said there are issues with how public bodies are “interpreting” the law.

The Tories have urged the Scottish Government to clarify its position on single-sex spaces for women and if trans people should have access to them.

Ms Gosal told Ms Kaukab that “all too often it looks as if women are thrown under the bus in favour of trans ideology”.

She said there was “no respect and dignity” for women and girls in single-sex spaces if people who are biologically male were allowed to enter.

The equalities minister said the Scottish Government has been clear that all public bodies should follow the law, including the Equality Act 2010.

She told MSPs: “My job is to make sure that we balance those rights in a compassionate and kindly way that is within the law.”

She added: “I understand that there is a bigger debate around this that has become very polarised and there are very strong feelings, and I understand that, and it is difficult.

“But, as I said, my position is that it is not a competition, it is not a hierarchy.

“And if we start from that, and dignity and fairness then, of course, nobody should be getting undressed in a situation that they feel uncomfortable in – nobody should.”

Speaking in Parliament later on Tuesday, Tory MSP Tess White said Care Inspectorate guidance covering trans and non-binary young people stated that “the provision of gendered facilities such as toilets is a social convention” and that there is “no law in Scotland about this”.

She told MSPs this was a “ludicrous and frankly chilling statement from a regulator that is supposed to protect Scotland’s most vulnerable children and people”.

The Tory added: “There are massive, massive safeguarding issues arising from this reckless guidance.”

She said the Scottish Prison Service (SPS) was also “allowing trans-identified prison officers to perform intimate and utterly unacceptable rub-down searches of vulnerable women visiting the prison estate”.

Ms White insisted: “Violent trans-identifying men can still be housed in the female prison estate in certain circumstances.”

She called on the Government to “finally do the decent thing” and “lay down the law on Scotland’s public bodies and tell them to withdraw this ill-informed and insidious guidance, which allows the rights of male-bodied individuals to transcend those of women and girls”.

Social Justice Secretary Shirley-Anne Somerville said issues around the operation of this was a matter for the EHRC as the enforcement body for the Equality Act.

On the Care Inspectorate, she said: “Everyone in Scotland deserves to receive safe and high-quality care that meets their needs and respects their rights and choices.

“And it is very important that the rights of, and the rights to, all of those involved are considered and respected in everything that is done.”

Speaking about the SPS, she said that while the law means prison visitors are searched, “consent is required” for this.

She said the rules made clear that “general searching of the person or their clothing is to be done by an officer of the same gender as the visitor” and that this “must be completed as quickly and as decently as possible”.

Ms Somerville also noted a prison visitor being searched cannot be required to remove any clothing, other than a coat or jacket, and any headgear, gloves or footwear.

A spokesperson for the Care Inspectorate said: “This guidance was developed for care services because they asked us for advice on how they can best support all young people in their care, including transgender and non-binary young people.

“The document is based on good practice guidance, referenced throughout. It was most recently updated in May 2024 to take account of changes to legislation and guidance, and feedback from stakeholders. We will update it again as and when available guidance and legislation changes.

“The guidance states that discussions with young people and robust risk assessment should inform individualised approaches for each young person, taking appropriate account of the wishes, rights and needs of all young people experiencing care.

“The guidance also references our design guide for care homes for children and young people, which states that we expect careful consideration is taken to ensure all young people’s privacy and dignity when accessing facilities.

“It is for care services to decide on the appropriate provision of facilities to meet the individual needs, rights and wishes of those experiencing care.

“If anyone has a concern about a care service they can contact us on 0345 600 9527.”

A Scottish Prison Service spokesperson said: “The rights and well-being of all who live, work and visit our establishments, are a key priority for us.

“A duty manager is available in every establishment for visitors to speak to about any concerns or issues they may have.”

A Police Scotland spokesperson said: “Our policies are being reviewed as part of our wider sex and gender review which is ongoing.”